Minutes 09-17-68FT~S OF oFECIAL ?L&F~ING
"
~PT~,<M~~ !7~ 1~68 AT CITY
Pobert Olds,
!~ymard }?ertz, Vice
Stanley ~Zeaver
Jsmes ~ ~ac3lpine
Col. Albert %~%kre!l
Fey Ward
Leon C!outier
Stuart Fuller, E~2i!din8 Lnspector
}~r. 01ds opened the meeting.
Approval of ~,fim2tes of P~egular ~:%etLng of Septen~er 3~ 19~.8.
Hr. ~%aver aa'vised ~/cat ~.cre is one correctic~_ at tod of Pale 3~ first
line, ~2~e n~ ~'GobeP: should, re~
Zebu1 . ~fr. Weaver ~ved ~e mLnutes be
~proved ~ co~cted. S~cor_dmd. by ?fr. ?Ta~.tpine. Un~imously ca~ied.
OLD
EDEN PLAT on tke table.
Col, Fehre!! moved that Lake Eden Plat 5e rewoved from tl:e table for discussion.
Seconded. by Nr. !?eaver. ILnanimous!y carried~,
Weaver stated ~at since tkere is not a ~presentative from.- the dsveloper
hcr~ ~md sLnce it is mDre of a suggestion ~.d. since it
wi~h ~he csnal; etc.
..~r. Olds stated that we are aware of t~.,~ fact that ,~ h~
..~ tkere ....~',~ ~een no P~ntion
of ~e fact ~out s~ers~ etc.
}:¥. !i~ertz stated
~.,=t ~,~ ssa~, ~is ~he first time~ at our last ~et~g
ho di&~Pt ~alizo it was SoLng to be on tko
Agen.~; tonight. I 6on't
%',~ shoed act on it ~til ~,~e have a fLna! 'n~ '
eng~.~e~E plan,
k~. Weaver. ~oy don't w~t to go tke t/~e erper,3e of a final engineering
plan until w.e approve what tb.e¥ are plsrmLng, to do
Nr. %~srtz: I reco~nd ~.at a letter be ~itten to the develcger notifyLng.
%hem ~at ~9 find no objection to the sl:etc%, of plan submitted to us and
tm_less there are Eoin2 to be so~e major d:.an2es iD_ t~.e pla.ns~ it would be our
su£gestion ~]~at they have ~!e final plan3 drs~,~m up for approval of tJze
Pla~Jling ~ ZoD_i~%g Board. and submit them to us,
-!-
i~inutes - Speci~/ P~etin[
Planning ~ Zoning Board
September 17, 196C
DAVID WOLFE ~LA%; on the raffle.
1'<¥. ~%aver ~oved ~at we t~J~ ~o Parc ~..%!fe Plat off the table for dis-
~sion. c~conood by %~h~z. lD~nin]o~ly carried..
?~r. t',reaver askeo ?{r. Fuller if he hsJ a chance to d~eck the ease[~3~nts ~ere.
Is ~ere gray water line there ~?
Fuller. i ~;~.,,~_,~'+~ chec~:,.ud'~=, it out, as I di¢~n't l~,,r you w~nted it
?r. !~eaver: After ~' ~' '
t!~mc~ng it over~ I th~nk !st Street shotdd, go
t~z~-.,t are~, the way it is
it n~gb.t ca~e co~idersfole cor_%~ion L~.
~r Ci~~ Pls_~mer ~Iso feels the s~ way.
Col Wehrs!l: Inasn%ud% ~3 our P!g_r~._-er believes that it is a ncc~ss.~r/North-
South road and ?~uld possibly e!i~d_rmt~ some traffic from~ Seacrest, I ~}eli~ve
too~ that it should stay ino
}~r..Wertz: In f~_cir presentation last ms~eting~ ~J~e only valid, co~ent they
mentioned~ regar 'ding ~ndon~ent of 1st Street, ~ for parking sp~,ces~ ~ut
if they s~e going to use t~s,t for n~ore buildS_nas, %%.on I sm~ not in favor
of it at all.
Ffr. Sm&~% ~.~r. P,M~e's Assists_hr: Your 2nd mhd 3rd Streets do not tie in.
~ney are offset ~ this is ~e only place you could get g reasonsf~.!e tie-~.
To ~l~e a cu~ ~ ~ block distance ~,:~d bo almost i~ossi~3!e. It
overburden ~he tr~fic situation on goacrest ~d. t~at is ~e t?~.ing '~ze don't
~,~nt to do. ~at is o~ m~njor ~s3on for setting it out tho way ~,~,o
Col, '~Johrelt moved ths. t in vie;:r of our discussion ~nd. I,,¥. S~_ifn's reco~m~n-
darien ~itJ~ valid reasons t1~at
Plat be net ~proved ~'~%d ~.at 1st Str,~et should go througJ~, fro~0 $. !r. 2nd
Avenue to S. W. 6th A~nuo. Seconded by }¥. !'?ea~er. !,h~imcu$ty carried,.
This property involves I1 lots z~nd they ~ril! be 60' x t0P' with
behind ~2%e~... ~]~e idea is to build single kom~s cn it. It h85 been su~itted
to us to advise as tc ,~rhet~_er it is practical or not.
~r. Ft~ller: Is ~J,.at !she going to be fenced.? Is it a dead lake, ~rith nc
water coming in or going out?
~.,~T. Fil~i's interpreter: ~.e ls]<e ~1I go v,~ry close to ~he property
%~at ho is pl~ is ~tusl!y to t~ the ~ out first ~d dig out the
l~e to g~t ~e fill te bring ~e he~e lots hi~er th~ ~%~ street level.
~7.e~ is also ~o~%er q~sti~ ~ding sewers.
-2-
h~utes Special .L~eting
Planning g Zoning Board
September t7, 1968
Mr. Olds: It is m/ opinion that this should go before the Ci~r KnEineer as
you have to ~_ave water and sewer and also to find. out if this digging is
going to be practical.
~.~r. Fuller: I think it should go Lefore the Engineering .~nepartm~,ent for this
checking first.
Discussicn held.
Cci. $?ehrell: I feel it would be mere feasible to have th.e City ~ngineer
go into this be£ore ~ go ~.ead on it ~nd see ,,~uat he advises us.
Mr. l?eaver: ~is land is higher thmn Leisureville snd I guess they are going
to bring it up_ to a higher elew~tion, but I ~ concerned regarding the Lake.
Are they going to give this lake te the City? If not~ this would ~en be a
private body of water whirl.'., couId become stagm._.~t, etc. sm.d this would be
a ree~ big prc~otem to keep oa% ~%e ~squitcs, weed3, ~tc. smd you could end
trp with. a bad situation with I1 o%mers. A ls_ke a~out t~is size could
cost the indivick;a! property ~ers about $200.00 per year from eac/~ owner.
I thimk the City Pmgineer should d'~ed~, ~_is out further before we go $~head
v. ith it. I~ might be better in ~....e long rrm snd fill fao whole thing back
It would be expensive I Imc~, but it would be better doing it that way.
Discussion held.
.~r. Wertz: Do you Imow who o~ms ~e property adjacent to it on the !,'?est?
I~-[r. Ni!d~i' s interpreter:
west cf our property.
Yes, ~r. Field from ~. He m~s about SS acres
Pk. I?ertz: Is there any date for developing this property?
~,~. Ni~ci's hnterpretcr: Yes, ~ is interested in investing his money.
k~. Weaver: Actua!ly~ we cmn't msJce s~y great objection to ~?~is so len~
ss it conforms >~_th the City- ,=~d it is um to the Cotm. ci! to decide ~.ether
or not they would alle~- t~is. ~re 1,~ave no ordinance that ! c~ recall that
covers this particular
Iv~r. Olds: ?,~ objections to the water area is the san~ a~ F!r. Weaver. If
it is practical, it would be alright, but fr~ *~.e way g~v~h ~ this part
t!~2 co~t~ gets~ I don't ~o~,~ if you would w~mt it yourse'!ves.
Discussion held.
Col '.,...qehrell: 7me. ther lake they were talking about is c~nsiderably larger
piece of imnd smd ~J~e l~2<e would be a wi~.~ning of mn existing cmnal which is
part of the drainage system smd. does have a flc~ of ~ter iD. it.
!4r. Weaver: ~'~.is l~<e would be sta~nmnt end t~ere would Be no vmter coming
in or out - it really would present a serious problem. I ~on't f:~iM~ this
~.{inutes - Special ~.beting
P!amning g Zoning Burro.
September 17, 1968
is a very goodlee~.' '~ ~ It is less expensive, !0ut not as practical.
I~{r. Ni~ki's interpreter: I ~ave been in the b,~l,~ing~ ~ business for 20 years
in U. S. A. sad quite a f~ years in Burop~, in Fort Lauderdale .~mnd in Atlantis
etc., tJ~ey don't have any water coming into t%eir cmnals.
~r. Weaver: Atl~ntis has drainage, i i~ow about that. In Ls3ad~rdale, I
don' t kaow about down there.
Discussion held.
Col Wmhre!! · ~.~ -'
..... Loulc it be possible for you to develop these lots without
creating tghis L~?
~fr. Nikki's interpreter: It would be i~ossible, it needs fill.
}~r. Weaver: You want to bring it to ~_n e!evatien of 16' ?
~<r. Nikki's interpreter: !7~.
?.{r. t~.baver: Venetimn Isles is sbeut !5', Leisurevi!le is going to be about
15'~ so it is possible you don't need Guite as ~.ch. as you thine. At 15'
you would b~ 4~ above flood. That wo~d cut quite a bit ~f your fill out if
you dic~n't go up to *J~at height. If I were you, I would cl:.eck witl~, your
~ngineer as to why you shcu.!¢~ go ,~ te 17'. You c~.n't build on muck.
>~r. Olds: }?e can express opininns, which we have done~ but we cm~mot take
shy final action on this, ~m we~ don't have t~e~ au%%ori~, i~e suggest that
your engLneer get together ~t~ our City EngLneer and fe ever
}~r. Nil%~i's interpreter: Could. you s~nc us some ~in~ of a letter c~ this,
send. it to ~r. ~ikki?
?~r. Olds - ~ ~ ~
reques~e.,~ ~¥.r. F~,ller to !~ave the City write ?r. Ni~ki en tB_~s, for
the Planning Board.
k!r. SmRth~ of Gerald DM~e Associates took over the ~eting at this point, to
discuss the prelimLnary report th. at was sub~.~tted totl.,~e~ Beard.
Before we got into tJ~e priF~.ry purpose of this meeting, from vie~dng some of
tah~ meetings in the past, ~o~re seems to be a need for so~ work on pro-
cedural ~ings smd we a~ going ~.to ~e Codes ~d Ordin~.ces a little later
~ad at ~'~is ti~ we v~!l t~ to est~!ish something on this especially ~
platt~g. PriF~rily engineering will be sm_~zered by the e~g~eering ~epart-
Front amd ~e different depa~ent hea~ v~!l have a ~ce to m~ke their
recommendations ~nd ~en t~ ~oa'r~ has sn ~oport~ity to ~ow eve~th~
about it ~d ~en ~e Co, oil gets it, it will be in pretty much final fo~
a.nd t~ey will ]m~ pretty ~da what is going to be done. ~e depar~ent
heads ha~ ~ered all the necessa~ questiorm ~d by the time the Co~cil
gets it~ it will be ~ final fo~. %%~ith som~ goo~], v~itten p~cedu~s, ~is
cs_n save you mP~y tho~ds of dollars ~. the ~t~e. ~ock~g a plat ~
the spot~ no one c~ do it. It tsJ~es conside~ble p~c~dures to ta~e care
of tk~ese th~gs ~d have t!~em riFY~t. ~ci~ ~xcepti~s are so~ing el~
4-
~inutes - Specia.1
Plannins ~ Zoning Board
Septer~er 17, 1968
that should be iayed out in procedure. We 6o w~.t to get to ~ork ~ these
th~ngs ~d just as soon as we ~r~ we will ~let to ~his. If you j~t catch
~e m~s~{o, it c~u save you ~c~.ds of dollars. ~o pta~s are
bigger~ ~ne c~v~l~m~ts a~ larger ~d the d~evelopers are ~na~r, otc,
~e main issue for ~is even~.~' is ~%e prelimins.~ draft ef the economics of
~e Ci~. }~e dr~ t~ a ~u~h ~.raft so thai it ~o~ represent ~ tr~ds.
It ws~ j~t a ~h draft; ~ch of it from the Co~.~ ~d so~ f~m though-
out ~%$ Btate. ~z~Sat we are t~ing to establish new is trends. I w~t~d to
go over ~is witt~ you from your point of view. It is ~rely a preli~na~
~ whe~ outline ~ese pl~3 as we s~ them ~ let you d~}eck~ them
d.r~. t we
o~r ~nd ~ee~ back the smmwers tc us ~ you li~ he~ ~n d~e Ci~.
~s it ~it ~ wi~ ~hcughts ~u h~8~ in mind? ~.st di~ you ~ina~ in it
you wish to d~eck over tonight?
Col ~%hrell: It is primarily a ~tstistic~ ~port ~ ve~ ~o~ativ~
it is ~thout ~y sro~t chmnges ~m ~ m~d. It is sood ~or possib~o ch~es
we neeR ~n~ Sood ~or ac~vs~ising pu~ose~. I h~ve no ciritcism o~ tho ~port
~ ~er~ you ~'ot your
per so ~ it is mostly statistical ~d t ~.~'t ~ ~
info~ati~ f~m. Your trends sc~..~ logical ~ i~r ~ I sm~
IgOr. Wea~r: I feel tho ss~ ~y the Col. ~.oes. It is ~n ~.~eement with
~ost of your trend magazines~ Florida Pcv~er g. Light p~!ictioD3 ~d
that do g lot of ~is ~e of work. In tall<~g wi~h ~ople fro~, the
we f~d. out what their i~.eas are ~ to the projection of their p~pe~y
h~ mudt ~ney would be or co~d be s~n~ en it. I ~ip~ this is gorily
a ve~ good ~port especially s~ you call it a p~l~Ln~ r~ort. ~_ere
have been at least ~o people wh~ have ~kec~ me if this ~port would.
avail~te for p~!icity pu~oses~ the ~amber of Cc~rce ~n~ son~ of the real
estate people ~ Tc~ wc~c~ like to have so~ copies. ~ne Ci~
need to do sc~ st~ng ~hi~king about ~_nsion of puSlic facilities.
Bve~thing seem~ to go ~o the }?est Palm ~a~a ar~a mhd I ~on't ~ow 5~w
Ce%~ty or Heal~. ~pa~nt c~n tell a small ~evet~er to put in sewe~, etc.
~e p~jection part of this pl~ is whero the importance is to e~end ~ese
things into the overall ~t~e pl8rm~.g cf the City.
l~4r. Smi~: ~is ~11 indic~te a ce~ain n~Ber of people ~n. at ~.D~d be
~g into ~e ar~a. ~7]~ere a~ w~ ~oin~ to put %hem~ etc. ? !-~ far c~
the Ci~, ~? Hm~z far will the City go? l?~at are ~e faciD?~ etc. in dollars
etc. ~d h~ do w~ t~ care of it ~ outlying ares~? ~is is something
real esta~ ~d b%~iness~n wo~d have to pay for to ~.d~rtise ~.eir proper~
etc. !~e ~ fin~. sc~ things theft we w~t to d~ge. ~;~at ~c we ~c a~ut
~hsng~g ~m ~nd %that goals will be m~e, etc.?
Col l~fehrell: We are askec! contin~usty for spot zm~g changes ~. we
don't s~d will not do it. ~is parti~2s~r area is~ I'm ~ferr~g to one we
hac! a sho~ ti~ ago, possibly g logics1 place for apa~ents~ but it is
now in a p~t~ goo~_, or fari!y good residential zone s~_8 we are ne~.r!y
always tu~ing ~e~ d~ s~ it is spot z~in~. So~st may be a !o~ic~
plac~ for ~ar~ents. S.W. 15th Ave~e ~.~1~ be coming along. ~m~ shoed
%ha~ ~ z~ed?
-5
}.,~trCas Special M~eti~f
Pla~ming ~ ZonLng Board
~pte~ber 17, 1968
Nr. Sr~i~h: From ~ese t~D?s you estimate ~,f~at t~e ~sire will be~ etc.
t%e ~9~t cf l~d ~nd ~he a~a you ~a~ for tl~is ~e cf situation ~d you
t~ to ta~e ~e are~ aevetcped for c,~ t~o of build~ s~i!ar to ~at is
a!~a~ ~.ero. You est~biish ~he nee~s ~.d then we will ra~ew t!~_~ zoning
in ~%e Ci'~. L~d uso for the next ~cnty years a~nd ~.th~_ yo~
t~nd., ~.Cloping arc~, small 5~ir~ss a~as, etc. wi~% each major
you ~ave to ~for it tc ~.e cver~!l proffer, to see 5o~,7 it fits. You t~ to
. .~v~l._pmn and
protect ~.o zoning you have now so ~at you don~t J. raw ~ed ~ a ~ ~ ts
~_at is ~,~.ere ~ p~51er~ come.
Nr. Weaver: In ~cca ~aton~ ~lr~ ~gd~. ~?. ~long the Intracoast~,
have all ~s Ln sp~gll P~as ~i~ 5~ apartments that are rent,s
the wate~ ~nd right a~oss t~.e st~t a~ $50~000. homes. I J~_'t
what ~pe cf zon~g~ they have~ bul it looks like a mi~u~ of zoning.
~. S~g~: ~ere is a ~,,ing ~, ?evel~pments to msJ~e t~ese ~ixed zo~s~
together ~{'. we actu~!ly ~st t~ to fit it in w~9~ we car., to its
zcn~g ~d m~t bo ccp~ider~d sn~ umual!y it ce~s ~d~r ~cial ~xcepticns
project to you.
I¥[r. /%a~r: Some control is ~ore (~esirs~!e ~om~ no ccnt~,l ~m~d t~ taste
cf some pecpl~ leaves a lo~ to be
}{r. Smi~: ~e %.~7~o1~ concept is ~ixed use of !s~zd v~i~ ree~om~le practi-
cality. Ui~. Special Exception you c~n ~et ~o~m to the size of a si~
you c~n hol~l ~e~ tc ~asl plum legally. ~ere s~oul~l be exist~g plsms
layout pl~.s, it starts %~i~'~ ~%~ concept t~.~l nc~pally they a~ not
but ~d~r Special E~epti~ it may be pe~mittcC. ~%e burton cf p~cf is on
%he fD~loper so he has to p~vide to. you~ ~a~ p~vo tc yc, u~ ~at it is a
good oxceptica~ It cs~ 5o utilizo~~. in ~ultiFle ho~ing~ s~_gle f~i!y
in commercial. It cng be ~ec! ~nD~hore~ Tca ~ecial Exception~ you
atta~'~ conditions ~.d it is l~gal ~ it spells cut in ~n~rc ~hat a Zoning'
Board or Co,Ici! ~n sltgdo cc~n(~iticns, l~?ith Special Fxccpticn~ you sho~d
~ow exactly what is going ~.ore, if it is not ccnst~ctef ~%at way~ you
clo not iss~ s~ coolant. ~]~ ~;pe cf ~volc9m~nt ~rcu~hcut the cc~t~
a~ demander something ether ~o.~ ~'~.o st~dard zoning that is eve~.ero.
1,~ycr Nid~l: !{e advised t?~r. Smith ~'~at ~e is g!aF~ the $pecis/ Exception
~ is getti~ ira. to ~ing ~,d we ~11 be !~lad tn get that ~to effect.
~ssell & ~on have given us a prelimina~ mpor't c~ the sewer ~d wi~h the
Co~!o~nt of Loisureville, it %~11 msXe it possible for fac Ci~ to gc
~_ead on the sc,~er system.. Golf View }}a~aur ~.~' Leisureville are co~ainly
beef{ a tre~:~ndo~ help to ~,
Discussion held.
.:r. i%awsr moved that the :~¢eting be ~journac!. ed by
l~o~ly envied. }{eating ac3ou~d at 9:20